Amien Rais' influence stems not just from his position as chairman of Indonesia's highest legislative body, the People's Consultative Assembly. The onetime Yogyakarta-based academic also wields considerable clout with Islamic political parties. Time's Andrew Perrin intercepted Rais, 58, in the VIP lounge at Denpasar Airport and quizzed him about the Bali blasts.
TIME:Was this the work of Islamic extremists? Rais: The Bali bombings have certainly convinced us that Indonesians are involved in international terrorism. If it's proven that the guilty are Muslims—or, for that matter, Hindus, Christians, Buddhists, communists, I don't care—they must be given severe punishment—the death sentence—because what they have done is barbaric, inhuman, satanic. Even if the perpetrators are Muslims, Muslims in Indonesia will be very, very happy to see them punished with the death sentence. Only insane people are not sad and disheartened by this kind of terror.
TIME:Were the Bali attacks an Indonesian intelligence failure? Rais: I don't think so. These terrorists are very cunning. Even smart and sophisticated intelligence organizations cannot stop them. Look at the Sept. 11 attacks.
TIME:Is President Megawati committed to tackling terrorism? Rais: She is well intentioned but sometimes she doesn't perform satisfactorily probably because she doesn't know what's going on. When Harry Truman was U.S. President, he said, "The buck stops here." Megawati should say the same thing. Every big issue should stop at her desk. She has to take responsibility and give direction to a problem like terrorism, but we have very weak leadership.
Let me give you an example of that. Three days ago, right here in the airport's VIP lounge, I was talking to our intelligence chief [Hendropriyono] in the presence of a Cabinet minister and the Bali governor. I asked Mr. Hendropriyono what he had accomplished so far. He just said his people were working on the case. I told him to establish a command post in Bali to better monitor and analyze things. He then told his assistant to make a note: "We have to have a command post in Bali." I added that a command post would also make it easier to coordinate with the intelligence officers from other countries who are here. So Hendropriyono tells his assistant: "We need some people with good English proficiency." This is simple stuff I am telling him. If I were President, I would call the chief of staff, director of national intelligence, police chief, Minister of Domestic Affairs and people from other departments and tell the team they have to make a report to journalists every six or 12 hours so everyone can share in what we are doing. But by doing almost nothing, we give many countries reason to be concerned, because they don't know what we are doing.
TIME:What is Indonesia's future? Rais: The outlook is extremely gloomy. If this case is not solved, Indonesia will be isolated and will become a pariah state. If such a terrorist act occurs again in Indonesia, we will be considered a producer of insecurity. This is a matter of life and death for the future of this republic.
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