Interview with JENS REICH : From Submission To Revolution

Q. Did you ever consider going to West Germany before the Wall went up?

A. We regretted many times afterward that we did not do it. I would like to have done something in Big Science abroad. I even applied via relatives to study in the U.S. But it never materialized. There was also pressure from my parents. My father always said Mother would not survive it.

Q. What were your early political views?

A. By the 1950s I had already read Arthur Koestler's Darkness at Noon. Also historical accounts about Hitler; why he was never overthrown. I must say I was always against the system. We called it "contra" then. My parents were as well. My father is a bit red. But my mother made sure we were instructed as Catholics. There was always internal resistance. We thought the system could not last long, that we had to accept it as a result of the war, of Hitler's despotism and the cruelty of that regime. Yet we were always afraid of being denounced. My mother was always anxious, telling us, "Don't say anything political," when we went to school.

Q. Why did you become a scientist?

A. It was camouflage. I would have preferred to pursue liberal arts, but they were pervaded by the ideology. You were forced to profess Marxism-Leninism. That was impossible. My father, who is a doctor, said, "Go into science or medicine. This is where you can survive as a person."

Q. How did you become involved with New Forum?

A. For years we had dissidents, just like in Poland and Russia. Then, in the early '80s we began to live. There were individualistic and bohemian groups of all stripes: hippies, Maoists, anarchists, human rights groups, lesbians, gays. It was a very colorful mix. And somewhat deterring. My wife Eva and I felt like white crows in that crowd. Though they were all very friendly to us, they even attacked the church, which gave them shelter. There were a lot of fights, informers, subversion. They could not possibly become a real political force. What they did was very brave, but it couldn't work. We had to reach out to a more respectable, middle-aged generation, come out of this social ghetto, out of the church, out of Berlin and out of highbrow theories. We had to - appeal to engineers, doctors, nurses, teachers and bricklayers.

Finally, 30 of us came together on Sept. 9 near Berlin. I knew only a third of them. We worked out our manifesto. Our meeting coincided with the exodus through Hungary and the mounting demonstrations in Leipzig. It became a grass- roots movement. People were copying the manifesto everywhere. The regime could not have been overthrown by a party, only by this kind of popular uprising.

Q. Goethe said life was a metaphor. What is the metaphor for your life during the past 40 years?

A. Living in a snail's shell, being able to hide and defend what you considered worth living for: culture, tradition, family, Germany in a way. We were defending German soil. Had we left, there would have been a desert. A snail, sitting in its cozy shell, making itself as comfortable as possible, occasionally putting out its antennae to find out what life is like. But in our shells we always had time for others. People in our circle of friends became a little like Slavs, who in their long winters seem to have plenty of time to play chess, chat or discuss their religion. I hope these habits do not wane.