Andrei Kozyrev: You Can't Expect Angels To Appear Overnight

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The man walking the tightrope between the demands of Russia's ultranationalists and the desire to bring the country into a closer partnership with the West is Foreign Minister Andrei Kozyrev, 43. In an interview with editorial director Henry Muller, managing editor James Gaines and International managing editor Karsten Prager last week, he spoke about some of his concerns.

TIME: What do you expect to accomplish at this week's G-7 summit in Naples?

Kozyrev: This is an important, even decisive meeting, since we expect the G-7 to become the G-8 ((with Russia's inclusion)). There should be important discussions on world politics -- the situation in Bosnia, Korea, nuclear nonproliferation, other regional issues. But this is just the political aspect. We'll also try to engage our partners in a more substantive discussion of Russian participation in the economic field, since we are becoming a more and more active factor in world markets.

TIME: Are you encountering resistance from the G-7 nations to your inclusion?

Kozyrev: Yes, of course. It's a peculiar situation: on the one hand, the need to include Russia is understood ((by the G-7 partners)), because it is in the best interests of both Russia and the West. The alternative would be awful: the isolation of Russia and confrontation with the outside world -- something everybody wants to avoid. Still, we face considerable difficulties when it comes to practical matters. This is quite natural. Russia is a very special case, since it is a major country with equal interests in the East and in the West. Sometimes, I wonder myself how we can manage to balance these kinds of global interests. Consider the case of Korea. Korea is a direct concern for Russia, probably more than for the U.S., because it is so close to us. Should Korea become a nuclear power, there is a more direct danger to Russia from nuclear fallout than to the U.S.

TIME: How do you build new partnerships while convincing everyone that Russia does not have new imperial ambitions?

Kozyrev: There is internal strife in Russia. There is a party of war, new imperialists, even fascists. Two days ago, I was so outraged by their attacks against me in parliament that I called them all "political bastards." They had called me a traitor for signing the Partnership for Peace ((with NATO)). I felt I had the right to answer them in kind.

Such healthy debate and lovely talk! There is a total lack of political culture in the whole space of the former Soviet Union. The typical Soviet mentality was to take up your rifle and grab power. We were brought up with this idea. One day Comrade Lenin did it, so you too can seize a gun and establish a paradise on earth. Now there is more than one Comrade Lenin in our areas of ethnic conflict. After they take up their rifles, they ask for peacekeeping forces, which really means, "Be with me and help me defeat the other side -- if you don't, you're imperialists." That is why we ask -- beg -- for an international presence.

TIME: Have you made any progress in persuading your Western partners not to lecture you?